WWL>Topics>>10-30-13 11:10am Garland: on Mexico's drug cartels

10-30-13 11:10am Garland: on Mexico's drug cartels

Oct 30, 2013|

Garland talks with Robert Mazur, DEA undercover agent and author of "The Infiltrator," about whether Mexico's drug cartels are dying.

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Automatically Generated Transcript (may not be 100% accurate)

Read an article. Couple a few hundred years ago and -- -- gunmen in the hormone costume I think it was Q1 could be wrong. Charlie killed one of the top cartel members of a leader. One of the I think Mexico as two major drug cartels and -- -- -- -- -- top leaders of progress correctly -- Remember correctly. And just rendered. Article that was interesting didn't think anything about -- and sure about it. And that we got to the usually use publication that -- basically that the suggested that this killing. Is more evidence rouble weakening. Of one of the major drug court -- votes in and so. What impact will that have on us if in the morning it's all. Turned girls who have considered we've definitely upon more about this and thankfully we've got Robert measure. DDA under coverage and author on the in -- trader. My secret -- inside the dirty birds -- on the public school boards Medellin cartel. Are Robert welcome to the show. Much. Shirt and I appreciate that your and notifying those hopes it would Chenault wouldn't -- -- that -- get to listen -- right. But it did good for changes -- of people have to troops and come and own view that -- Tell me about this cloned killing Willis was it to you -- Yet the Tijuana cartel which also known as the I don't know Felix cartel that is a very very long history of this cartel. The person who was killed as Francisco Rafael. On -- Felix he's one of seven Brothers and four sisters who. Have been involved in the operation and it cartel. The interesting thing behind them is that. If you go back to the the beginnings of there rain in the in the underworld. It started off as the Guadalajara cartel. And it was their uncle who was one of the two leaders and they wound up beating. Targeted. Because unfortunately for the US in the drug enforcement administration. And Cameron family. DEA undercover agent. Enrique Kiki Cameron was in fact kidnapped. Tortured and murdered at the hands of the -- and Felix I'm at a Guadalajara. Cartel. And the uncle. Wound up getting forty year prison sentence in connection with that. Torture and murder. Of course what was really going on at that time is set to keep hammering and infiltrated. -- the Guadalajara cartel to the extent that we were now getting information. About a massive chaos that were being made by the owner Felix family. Two military. Law to law enforcement to elected officials. And judicial. Officials in Mexico. And he also. Identified plantations. That generated roughly well billions of dollars in revenue for the Guadalajara cartel that's why he was targeted that's what you kidnapped off the streets. In Guadalajara by corrupt. Mexican police officers. In part. And tortured and murdered and now we go fast from that and we China a split -- between. The in in which in the Guadalajara cartel that created. Two major cartels the Tijuana cartel the one we're speaking about run by the idea Felix family. And the other the Sinaloa Cartel. That is Iran. By. Chop the head of the Sinaloa Cartel. And as time went on and the US law enforcement. Targeted. Rightfully so the -- in the area Felix family because of their involvement. In massive corruption the costs of their involvement in the captivity -- undercover agent. Adam and and so many many of the individuals. Within that family. Have been taken out -- power for Cisco unveil roughly oh I am Felix to gentlemen we're talking about shot by the clown. Was at a party. In Baja California. When. More than a hundred people were there and someone dressed up as a -- supposedly to entertain everyone. I walked up to put around through his head and another through chest. On -- had been. In prison in Mexico. Then he had been extradited to the United States for further prosecution and the interesting thing to me is that. When he got to the United States. He only got a six year sentence and he only served apportion of that time. I went on to the. I will admit there was this after the torturing and killed yesterday agent. And gets pictures cents. Yet he spent I think about ten years in Mexican prisons and and he was extradited to the United States. Extradited -- in the US in 2006. -- a six year sentence on the it was a conspiracy to possess cocaine and possession of cocaine. And wound up being released early in 2008 that really got my attention. And I mean no one and two there's a web site that Taiwan can go to and subscribe to two. Identify the federal criminal prosecutions civil prosecutions in bankruptcies are on the United States. Actually suggested that this morning in connection would get it in and getting prepared for our interview here. And the interesting thing is that although I found the case. And there there are pleading that are in there. When you try to access them -- says that you can't accesses. Pleadings without contacting the court. Rory and I'm an afternoon repeated their particular -- first break. I have only about 20000 questions for review award too tall and we -- -- When we come back that lipstick and -- -- -- girl -- wanna talk about a gentleman by the name of Bob news so I think that you. Five years under carver with the Colombian drug cartels. Elected to during bankers. Laundering of money you -- the drug court to go all we don't. Hoping for the conviction of general Noriega. So let's go to a little back room would come back but we want to put this up on the -- sentence. -- amended kidnapped tortured and killed the DEA agent that that doesn't make in the cents. Governor of the -- seventy immoral 530. Redundant -- or taken about something called the Tijuana drug court 201 of the leaders killed. In Mexico. Recently. I think a week ago two weeks ago. And did it may have weakened one of these two major cartels in Mexico. And to better understand what this means to was if anything -- brought over measure. The U under coverage and author of the infiltrators. And and a whole lot. More complicated background and -- poll we go roberts' background. Would go back to Robert. What Roberts. I think you said brought forward took break. Is that this head of the YouTube on drug cartel and one that was killed. Also is instrumental in kidnapping torturing and killing the we age and wasn't caught and imprisoned in Mexico. Extradited to the United States and -- a mixture got Detroit only served six years and when you go to check on the record of this. You really can't get into the records and where remark wrong noun one thought -- Okay. The the person who was killed is one -- seven Brothers. Who whose uncle Miguel on health Felix a year ago. He is the individual who ordered along with some others within the -- Felix. Organization. The kidnapping torture and murder. To camera and when. -- until Felix Gallardo was taken into custody. His seven nephews. And nieces and became the leadership of that same cartel. It was. Felix -- -- who is in prison now for forty years but received forty years sentence for along with several others. And in your listeners may have heard not too long ago. Some rough fail. -- -- they'll cut broken -- was one of the other leaders. Responsible for the kidnapping of BHP. Camera and that individual who also received huge sentence in Mexico was released this year. On a quote technicality. That the federal authorities were the ones who tried and convicted and and this state. Should have been the the entities that did it. Well this -- done without any prior announcement to in the US authorities. Who had criminal charges outstanding for power and Terrell. And without telling President Obama or anybody connected with the Drug Enforcement Administration. In the middle of the night at 2 AM. -- can Caro was released from prison. It took pressure from the government over the last couple of months. To cause an extradition. But not an extradition about it and arrest or to be issued in Mexico for car and Terrell but by now he's hiding someplace he's fugitives. He is. Free. Attitude to roam the -- So they're they're not only. Individuals affiliated with the I channel Felix organizations that have gotten. Very soft sentences in this case Francisco -- audio Felix guy who was killed by the -- that the person dressed as a -- But also -- Euro was recently released. Why is it that I can't get access to the information well I'm I'm in the process of getting in touch with the court. The -- to see if I can get access but apparently this is something that has been established by the the judge in the case. And by the attorneys representing both parties but it's very very odd in my mind. To see an individual. The -- leader. Of one of the most powerful drug cartels in Mexico. Wind up being extradited to the United States -- let alone get execute sentence but he released after two years. Possibly that had something to do with his being killed I don't know I'm gonna keep trying to get into the records. That before again go forward go back and your background explain people you beat him knowledgeable and all of this. The Tijuana drug cartel has has it been grievously wounded and if so how does that affect us here in the United States. Little well it has been you know wounded substantially it was at times at war with the Sinaloa Cartel. The other half of what was originally. At a Guadalajara cartel. But as a result of the seven Brothers and you know Francisco Rafael. Audio Felix is -- one who was killed October 18 of this year. The other leaders in the air Benjamin you know Felix. He was extradited to the United States in 2011. So he's behind bars in in the US. It Bordeaux area called Felix was extradited to the United States in August of 2012. -- he's also they're. In the United States Ramon Eduardo -- Felix shot by police in Mexico and February 2002. And Francisco Javier area Felix was captured on August of 2006. So. Don't bulk of the leadership. Is in disarray number one and number two there was. And an announcement that was made. In 2012. By the Mexican authorities that they had won the other leaders the Tijuana cartel in. Custody and claimed that did Tijuana cartel and the Sinaloa Cartel form Patrice. Basically what -- one cartel. Elect is now doing is charging the fourth air for for bringing drops through a deal on the established routes that they have. So unfortunately. All of this movement in leadership then exchanges of power. Have little or no effect on the amount of illegal drugs that are on the streets in the united. Hooligans promotes like -- Campbell. Good to loops would get a couple minutes forward take a break. You were not always Robert merger you'll -- Bob you're so tell us about that. Sure. After being an agent for fourteen years Sam and -- principally working most of the time on the identifying trying to identify and prosecute the leadership and control. The Colombian cartels. And a higher level money launderers supporting them. The group that I was working with decided that really the most effective thing that we can do to try to make those cases we had. Moderate success with the typical wiretaps and search warrants an informant in historical cases. But we really felt that in order to. Find out to -- Who is in the leadership and control who's handling money that we need to do put a long term undercover operation together and infiltrate their money laundering systems. So I volunteered to be a long term undercover agent restrained in net field. And then -- has been about eighteen months putting together what I think is one of the more sophisticated France. For someone working long term undercover as a money launder. I was indebted to -- with a new identity. The identity of Robert Acela. In real active businesses and investment company mortgage brokerage business and air charter service for the private jet to read chain with seventy locations on the East Coast. Even a brokerage firm proceed on the New York Stock Exchange I didn't have to deliver best undercover agent I was really blessed with. Some great. Not teachers. Who had done this type of work before and leadership that gave me the latitude to be able to put that front together. Which became my protection my badge and my counterfeiting Terry badger got one in the world. And do do -- How Moses connected to -- general Noriega. Takedown. And my information says. In the end of your project more than it is men and women -- Charles worldwide it was called operations -- -- but how -- -- -- that occur. Well. -- questions for the help of informants in Colombia and in the US side became. Associated with some mid level people in the drug world. Eventually continued to build a poor hire Pitney. Leadership and I ultimately was dealing with many of the people who reported directly to Pablo Escobar including his principal can sickly variable here. In Medellin. Who was to the rest of the world practicing attorney dealt with the legislature to. Was also a professor at the university mean. But really was -- mastermind. If international money laundering schemes and that a person who at times and I was in a meeting when he did it. Would order the -- of individuals that they were concerned. We're not able ill to the organizational or posed as -- At the same time I -- began to work as a conduit for them. To what was the seventh largest privately held bank and the world bank of credit and commerce international BCCI. I dealt with although it was in 191000 simply bank. It's 72 countries I dealt with the senior management of the bank who had to. Devised a plan. To solicit deposits from the underworld. I thought that was a rather unusual thing for an international bank to be doing. But as a result of the assignment. I came ultimately to the conclusion. That it's not that unusual at all and I think there's a body of case. And that that's what I wondered talk Cuba via the banks the business people connected with a worldwide. We're coming right -- word talking Robert measured the heat but he undercover agent author of the infield trader. Coming right back you have questions comments -- -- 260187. And this is double up yeah. -- over the Robert blasier DEA undercover agent author of the infiltrators. And very modest I must say about what he's accomplished. While back could you went undercover. Some of the most dangerous. Criminal. Drug cartels in the world. When undercover for five years syndrome Colombia's drug cartels. Assuming you -- in her meetings with briefcase with quarters in that. -- -- -- and and associated with these people -- risk of his life on -- regular -- Then he staged the wedding. Turned down more than eighty million men and women -- patrolled charged worldwide. Part of isn't as huge and prove critical to the conviction of general. Manuel Noriega. Barbara before again in two -- where you've been what you've done what you see coming. What are Ditka a couple of questions that aren't directly related. Envelopes low can you explain money laundering. To meet. How does how does drug court to remembered what would you do get -- -- what happens could that be a longer and. Well you know there it is an infinite number of ways in which it can be done but that the real problem that these cartel leadership faces is that. Nobody sells drugs on the streets for anything other than cash. And it may be some people who are in the drug low low level drug business that. -- -- stealing money from the government under the false filing of tax returns and get these debit cards and can. Get thirty cents on the dollar and use them but when you get to that higher levels of the people who really run these organizations. And that doesn't even that doesn't compute that they take cash so they wind up with -- Literally mountains of currency. On the one principal client that I had. An island in Iraq among cop who was the number one manager Pablo Escobar and 60% of best departure out. Around the world. In the United States alone. I had the opportunity in dealing with them. And collect money in eight different cities and in each of those cities they had on average about twenty million dollar -- take. So a 160. Million dollars a month in currency. That needed to get to transformed into some usable fashion because if you have a houseful -- It's pretty difficult to use and people will profile. And not become on major targets. Of law enforcement so the trick is to come up with methods. By which this money can crossed borders and appeared to be legitimate money. Simply. Being handled in the normal course of the global. International. Sure an example of -- before. And the like would be sushi I did for me they would take in currency. They offer to take -- senior client at a mine and Luxembourg. And other locations. They would put that money in -- certificate of deposit. In an offshore corporate name. And usually hidden in Luxembourg. They would create what's called off book transactions. And they would loan me an amount of money and a different quarter from a different quarter of the world. In the name of a different corporation. And that money then I could transfer to three or four different. What we call eight and countries. Could have been through the Isle of Man. Off in office from France. And in between now and then England it could've been through Gibraltar -- have been through. Switzerland or Luxembourg but the money would move through three or four different jurisdictions that -- very little transparency. When it came to who really owns the corporations. Who really owns. The money and then ultimately I can have the money transferred to Panama. Panama. Has as its date currency to US dollar. So now I'm I'm sitting on account. In the fifth name and that that is in Panama and I can issue. Either wire transfers or checks. From there usually they would go to. Free zones in the united Indian throughout the world. So in Panama would be the -- Frito. Or it could be in Colombia and -- -- And that would be used to -- would be used to buy huge amounts of goods could be container relative. I'd change it could be container loads of refrigerators. It could be container loads of chicken. That would be imported into Colombia. And then sold through a series of stores that were established in and thereby the movement of the goods. Crossed borders movement of the money across borders were down and very secretive way -- could never be connected. To the illegal activity from Wichita game. What what you've just explained movie -- leads to my next question for the Perry thanks their room and take a look hard look at. Or things happening that -- we can't release the and particularly when it comes to the drug trade. Come on my bank Garland Robinette review we call that the thing. All right we're talking to Robert measured the -- under coverage and author of the book the infiltrators and Robert which a couple of hours -- I wanna go back to something sort of miniature -- And I'm paraphrasing obviously. I think you're sitting in Mexico when all the people were boasted the the track the money to politicians for the military to please is that correct. Well they certainly I don't know about tracking money pursue -- I think I can tell you that they were able to identify. That there worse specific. Law enforcement officers military personnel and elected officials. Who were on the cake at a Guadalajara cartel. Okay -- that in mind and we'll read some interview in this suit from the very mainstream media in December 13 2012. And appliances. Outrageous. HSBC's. Settlement approves the drug war is. And just used to one largest banks in the world England with many many distributors ships or -- Banks here in the states is what the article says. HSBC. Admit it long. Tens of billions of -- with a Colombian and Mexican drug court. And port terrorist organizations. When they were reports sorely in Bangladesh. Clients. They won't -- -- the United States government numerous content. That they were. Breaking the law in particular trading with the enemy act. Finally the government says the -- Where were soaring grew review we're gonna find they find him one point build one point nine billion dollars and everything you read says that's about five weeks of income. No member of the bank was there were Natan. Was ever prosecuted. In in the -- -- -- and the said the reason they didn't prosecuted in the body or close them about it. It would endangered. The financial system. When when I hear about drug money in portrait in words to be in Mexico. Why isn't the only difference here that that just sounds like. Here's one of the top banks in the world. Bread and laundering terrorism money and drug cartel money and they're not prosecute what it would among missed. You're not missing anything and matter fact everything is that accurate. Not only has -- been determined to -- in the course of action taken by HSBC. The pair of them merely a gut. Banks that our Department of Justice has identified. And. That has admitted to criminal offenses in connection with the handling this type of money and yet no individuals or very few individuals. Have ever been charged with any of this conduct certainly not -- HSBC certainly not with Wachovia bank. Non with Riggs bank not with bank Atlantic. None of the American Express bank international non with the Indian. -- union bank of Californians -- eagle and many other banks. And are based outside the United States that operate within our borders. We have historically believe that's because their parade -- collapse of Bancorp the banking system. Absolutely not I mean I think there are a number of things we need to take into consideration the last time I looked which -- Have to admit hasn't been in the last year -- but in 2010. I know there were 42 million dollars of lobbying money that was put forth. By the American Bankers Association and major banks that that operate in this country. I don't think it's hard to understand. How -- our Department of Justice. Led by a air colder and a man who just recently resigned. Who has a partner which there colder. Lanny brewer. It in the law firm Covington and -- you know before they came to the government they worked for covered in Burlington. In senior positions and I think Adam sperling. Their clientele of who's who of banks throughout the world. Now all of that to Lanny brewer became the subject of play PBS special. On the untouchables which is talking about the lack of any action taken by the Department of Justice concerning. The two banks of Wall Street. He resign and -- -- go according to a New York Times article that I read but he went back to Covington and Burlington enjoy reform million dollar yourself. If this happened in Mexico they call it corruption here in the United States it's been a parent appearance of a conflict of interest. I think people need to look at those types of things I think people need to look at the what the policy. Is within the Department of Justice criminal enforcement community about trying to address these issues Maxine Waters just two weeks ago about a week ago. And and some other congressman. Ted. Endorsed a new bill that supposedly is going to close the loopholes. That prevented the prosecution of the higher ups in the HSBC and other -- I you know I really think in her heart of hearts and in their -- of parts they think they're doing the right thing. But it's really part nothing more. Then a disservice to the American people to suggest that we don't have we -- statutes. -- Tools to be able to prosecute individuals who knowingly take drug money and push it through the bank. -- bigger and I had to Brooke do you believe me -- collected have you on there for about ten hours. Weird -- and run up against the clock how people get for book. The other titled the infiltrated. Well the best place to go to the web site for the book it's the -- infiltrators that town that's the -- infiltrators dot com. On the -- you'll see a lot of information about. The book it's reviews -- the movie development project its ongoing related to. -- and you'll also -- idea where to buy it and if you click on the edit digital links to Amazon.com and the other major distributors. That offer the book for -- Well I think -- -- scratched the surface in the U very unusual knowledge brings all this could we get to about -- later date. Thank you so much fascinating -- thank you put that to. It don't forget common. -- -- -- and dollars and give you the code word. Would get to lose eight to I would of urge you do have to read this article lips December 13 2012. -- bridges HSBC. EU settlement proves -- drug war is joke and it's a national bank with lots and lots and lots and lots of banks here in the United States world. And they admit it. After they wore wore a number of time and a view of government. That they -- laundering tens of billions of dollars for the Colombian and Mexican drug court votes. Indian violin and trading with the enemy act by working with terrorist. Camps and they didn't Stewart take.